Not. The API will lie about the content. Sorry thought that was clear.

You know, it never ceases to amaze me that with GSF up over 10,000 people, to say nothing of the rest of the CFC, people see a half-dozen goons pointing out blatantly obvious flaws in mechanics (and/or trolling the people who inevitably crop up to defend anything purely because the goons say it's not a good idea) and decide that's a 'high level of goon tears'.

Really? One of the largest, most active groups in the game, with a history of delving into the mechanics of the game looking for the loopholes and problems CCP refuses to see until GSF goes ahead and rubs someone's nose in it, has multiple people posting in a thread about mechanics - the very same people who post on all of these mechanics threads, no less - and you think that's somehow significant?

Let me put this bluntly, in terms of Sov war the CFC is the elite of Eve.

Hey guys, thanks for all the good feedback. Couple of things we're contemplating:

a) reduce waste factor from 20% to 10%

b) have a character limit on how many siphons you can deploy (i.e. have in space at the same time). This would probably be in the 5 to 10 range.

Let me know what you think.

Sorry but goons are the single largest holder of high end moons. This is 100% about them protecting their income.

It's about making it harder to detect it while you aren't logged in the game. Want to secure your POS? Go, and actually play EVE Online.

not at all ccp thinks that you should only setup what you can afford to loose... just like a pimp mission ship.

when i used to be active in 0.0 space (non npc) we would have people from australia to america who were pretty much online all day.

they would be busy ratting/plexing/mining/scaning and would notice if a nuet/red came into system

all they would have to do now is after said red leaves the system to do a spot check on the moon poses in system... you can use d-scan for this purpose

perhaps you should get renters to occupy your moon system to monitor them for you...

make it rent free as an instentive.

you have heard of providence right? terrible true sec but filled with ratters.

and yes if you provide free rent to null bears they will be more then happy to patrol the system for you. (i know i would if i were offered the system rent free)

hell just say to the renter if any moon goo is lost you have to pay me the difference.

plus d-scan will help reduce the amount of posses you have to fly too. (though those pesky systems with 20 moons around one planet will be a ***** to partrol)

moreover good true sec is usually taken by the host alliance and not the renters. so its logical to just shift some renters to key systems that hold r64-r32 moons.

also you can let the renter know which moons to monitor. (afaik there are limited amount of r64 moons... are there any systems where you have multiple r64 moons? or is it more one r64 max per system?)

think of it as an oppurtunity to fill 0.0 with bears that then can be hunted and provide fun between strat ops.

yes my jita price check and cyno alt is in a npc corp...

do you have a valid point to make or just stating it as an observation.

Oh you noticed the cycle ...

Still working on drone assist, it appears they are PERFECTLY BALANCED and cannot be abused

i am starting a new sevice... i call it siphon squad... i will personally monitor your poses for siphons. my only charge is erotic dancers, fedos and a nude photo of bea Arthur.

If they were the features wouldn' be released in an abuseably broken manner.

But they aren't, and thus we can have fun.


GOON TEARRSSSSSSSSS

Supposedly you can feed the horse salt, but in such cases it's more like rubbing salt on the wound

Yeah, livestock need to get minerals and so on, usually delivered in what is called a mineral lick. Salt and other things are very important for growth and health.

Our salt-containing tears, that is.

Can you add a limit on the number of POS you can maintain too?...

Also if you are so dead set on having waste you should have made it vent into space as small moon rocks that can be probed down or something that disappear in 30 days. Go to a belt, planet or something and behold, Technetium oil spill from a nearby moon...

The amount of posturing and whining by goons in this thread shows how good an idea it is.

"ablooblooblooooo my precious afk moon money"

It'll be good for the game, vast empty passages of space should have vulnerable resource streams.

My heart bleeds for you.

+1

Seriously, if an alliance of hundreds or thousands of players can't be bothered to put 1 alliance character in each system they own once every 3-4 hours, you deserve to lose the goo.

It takes seconds to scan and move on (especially with the warp changes), and you only have to get within 14AU to know if they're there.

A single char could check an entire region's moons in under 30 minutes.

get out

By siphons being a real mechanic in the game, means it will create player traffic. This means the opportunity for combat increases. Any POS operators that rely on some 3rd party tool to play the game for them will be the ones to suffer the most. Any groups that actually inhabit the space they have POS in will be just fine as they will have eyes in the system to see when a siphon is deployed.

I can't believe how heavily some groups rely on programs to play the game for them and go out of their way to make sure AFK game play and mechanics remain a thing for EVE. Pathetic.

Thank you for pointing out one of the reasons why Eve-O forums are shite.

It's ironic, but so are your tears.

HOWEVER, I do hear that, in the name of CONTENT, the CFC's blackops pilots are living in the ncdor renter space. SO it is in fact lived in, and quite active in terms of pvp

So many stupids talking about the API "lying to them".

It is absolutely moronic to think someone performing a type of in game covert sabotage against your corporation IN GAME should actually be flagged up nice and easily OUT OF GAME via API just to make your lives easier.

With whines like that it is no wonder everyone is trolling you - The question is: Is there really any reason Corp structures etc need to even be included in the API in the first place? (It is done to make life easier for POS folks, not to do half the maintenance work for them).

Tools already exist for POS fuelling via the in game calander, notifications are sent via mail in game for fuel, or when it is attacked, even when some random puts a tower up in your Sov etc...
I'd argue for a much harsher Eve without even the in game help for POS operators - and that players who can't be bothered to even log in to manage and maintain their Eve POS empires don't deserve those empires in the first place.

Right now CCP panders completely for the lazy community - adding any 'syphon warning' via the API would be a massive mistake.

And you can"t see the difference between a 'personal character monitor' and a 'automated alliance tool that monotors a complete empire like HAL 9000'.

You really cant can you?

You are being obtuse.

GÇó It is accepted that a moon mining POS is AFK income, as in it accrues materials while you are offline - so you are wrong.
GÇó You assume others have no knowledge of POS managment because they disagree with your whines - you are wrong (I have ran a POS network of 15 POS solo and know the issues and pain of doing so).
GÇó You are crying about Eve Fitting tool other API tools/data that have nothing to do with syphons and their (lack of) impact on the API - it just shows how obtuse you are being.
GÇó You are apparently delibrately confusing Two Steps suggestions (dead horse POS rework) with supporting your own agenda about syphons - Just because POS owners (myself included) badly want a rework of the mechanics in a threadnaught about POS mechanics doesn't mean they agree with you about syphons.
GÇó AFK Cloak whine - Stop talking rubbish about AFK cloaking laziness, you are being stupid and should go post in the relevant thread about that.

Fact is the API tool is useful for helping people do stuff out of game with the tools designed by players. These tools should NOT give an in game advantage, which is what some player designed 'syphon alert' system would do if POS syphoning appeared via the API.

1. There's always room for more economic warfare opportunities for the small gangs.. Get over it.
2. Nobody expects you to 'hang' around for days.. So it goes.. You lose some of your passive income. Find another revenue stream if you don't like it.
3. Don't pretend you're the Encyclopedia of nullsec.. The moon syphoning is another game mechanic you will need to accept and deal with instead of bitching about it.
4. your drag bubble analogy isn't accurate either. I shouldn't have to explain it for you further.

EDIT: My apologies. My response was not meant as an attack on you. Let me rephrase it this way. All of your points are silly.

1. Syphons won't so much create economic warfare as passive income for those placing syphons.

Nerf NC burn out cloaky AFK nulli monkeys stabbed ironic POS siphon thingys!!!

But the poses are afkkkkkkk and passiveeeeee

other than "picking up materials that accumulated while sleeping" and "putting in more fuel", there really isn't much else for you to do.

those are available in rens. thou you might want to swing by amarr for the self-hauling-product-to-jita-and-fuel-back-from-jita ones and i hear tales that dodixie has a few that self-refine-alchemy.

The fact you guys rely so heavily on API is why you guys are furious about having to actually have eyes out in your space to watch for the siphons. What can I say, but perhaps you guys should undock and go check them on your own initiative instead of waiting for some API finance team telling you what to do.

Free will bro. Embrace it.

But according to you and your people, all the money is made in high sec off those evil mission runners. What changed all of the sudden where low sec was the source for all the income in the game?

But earlier you all were going on how the Siphon is the perfect griefer tool for Goons and CFC. Now suddenly it is the perfect tool for hi sec players.

Did CCP make an update on the Siphon I missed? Please give us a link to this announcement. Thanks in advance. GÖÑ

The whole idea was dead on arrival when it wasn't about fleet combat and timers. All this "nerf" does is change its pointlessness from malignant to benign (or less malignant really).

If you had to roll up, defang the pos, anchor and guard the siphon(s) while they onlined, and then come back the next day to haul away all the target PoS mod's moon, reaction, or alchemy goo, then you'd have a feature that generates actual fun conflict and content.

This structure spam and grind bullshit was dead before it started, all you can do with this framework is make it more or less awful.

As a member of a small null alliance I love these changes. The siphons are an interesting idea and will be something I deploy on a regular basis with my Prowler. I think this will make for a lot more productive time gate camping too, since cloaky haulers will be in and out of null on a more regular basis to check on their little autonomous thieves.

Also the Goon response has been priceless. Here's my reaction to it.
http://www.ghostofthefuture.com/images/Ani2/UnfathomableSadness.gif

Assuming you trust the opinion of the goonswarm, who have consistently shown themselves as an exploitive economic coalition. Honestly, if they are raising hell about how OP and unfair this is its a good sign to me that the existence of this item really worries them. The 74 pages of goon tears are pretty much proof of that. Assuming that CCP doesn't cave to the cries of the goons who control the majority of the moons worth anything I think the siphon will be a nice piratical way to break their hold on the T2 market. And before any goons or alts thereof start debating me on that, I'll just remind people of Hulkageddon and that time of GoonFun.

If you have a low sec POS you'll be fine. Check it regularly, get your stuff back then shoot the siphon. This will mainly affect big alliances with many moons. The little guy will be fine.